Wes Anderson on The Phoenician Scheme: 'In a way, it's the kind of America I am drawn to, something that's so optimistic'

Extra.ie​

30-05-2025

As the director of the iconic likes of Rushmore, The Royal Tenenbaums and The Grand Budapest Hotel, every film from Wes Anderson is a bona fide cinematic event, and that's most definitely the case with his new espionage black comedy, The Phoenician Scheme.
Set in 1950, the action focuses on Anatole 'Zsa-zsa' Korda (Benicio del Toro), one of Europe's richest industrialists, who appoints his only daughter, Liesl (Mia Threapleton) – a nun – as the heir to his estate. As Korda embarks on a new enterprise, they become the target of scheming tycoons, foreign terrorists and lethal assassins. For good measure, along the way, Liesl also investigates the murder of her mother, Korda's first wife.
Boasting Anderson's trademark visual flair, The Phoenician Scheme – which he co-wrote with Roman Coppola – also features the director's customary deft mix of humour and pathos. Adding to the appeal, meanwhile, is a truly extraordinary ensemble cast. As one of Hollywood's premier filmmakers, Anderson has worked with his fair share of major stars, but this time he has outdone himself.
In addition to del Toro and newcomer Threapleton – whose mum is one Kate Winslet – the third lead is Michael Cera, who plays Zsa-zsa's Norwegian tutor, Bjorn. Thereafter, it might actually be quicker to list the A-listers who aren't in the movie, with those making appearances including – deep breath – Riz Ahmed, Tom Hanks, Bryan Cranston, Jeffrey Wright and Scarlett Johansson. Not to mention Richard Ayoade and Benedict Cumberbatch. Phew!
And having had the third act of his career, as the doyen of US indie cinema, launched by Anderson in Rushmore way back in'999, Bill Murray again returns to cameo in the role he may have been born to play: God.
But front and centre is del Toro as Zsa-zsa, who instantly takes his place in the pantheon of great Anderson anti-heroes. Wheeling and dealing on the post-war continent, Zsa-zsa is the archetypal European business tycoon, who perhaps enjoys even more mythical status than his American equivalents. (L to R) Actor Mathieu Amalric, director Wes Anderson, actors Mia Threapleton and Benicio Del Toro during the production of THE PHOENICIAN SCHEME. Credit: Roger Do Minh/TPS Productions/Focus Features © 2025 All Rights Reserved
'A certain type of businessman who can always pivot, ' suggests Anderson,' and has very little obligation to honour the truth'
With his enigmatic demeanour, meanwhile, Zsa-zsa's cinematic antecedents include Charles Foster Kane.
'The beginning of the story was to try to invent something about one of these 1950s Euro tycoons, like an Onassis or Niarchos,' says Anderson. 'I had read about Árpád Plesch and Calouste Gulbenkian, or Gianni Agnelli as well'
Korda's epic project represents the culmination of a decades-long, career-defining venture, which involves the realisation of Phoenicia's full socio-economic potential. As he looks to escape the clutches of the many enemies plotting his demise, Korda, Liesl, and their assorted partners must close The Gap (a rapidly expanding financial shortfall), which Zsa-zsa summarises as 'everything that we got – plus a little more'.
With The Phoenician Scheme laid out – in an elaborate set of shoeboxes, no less – the three amigos attempt to enlist the help of their various business partners. There's a summit with Prince Farouk (Riz Ahmed), and then there's an underground – literally, they meet in a tunnel – encounter with the duo Leland and Reagan, played respectively by Tom Hanks and Bryan Cranston.
'With the railroad men, even though it is a later era,' says Anderson, 'we still wanted something coming from the robber baron period, a JP Morgan-type railway man, though being Californian. That led us to Tom Hanks and Bryan Cranston. Roman and I had spent time with them together, and I just knew they had a very special character, and something totally American that you don't find anywhere else.
'In a way, it's the kind of America I am drawn to, something that's so optimistic. So we dreamed up this whole thing that's very West Coast America – the older West Coast, Sacramento – that I associate with that, which maybe comes out of Joan Didion somehow. But I am also thinking of Ronald Reagan. It's not the movie business, it's more Pasadena.' (L to R) Mia Threapleton as Liesl, Benicio Del Toro as Zsa-Zsa Korda and Michael Cera as Bjorn in director Wes Anderson's THE PHOENICIAN SCHEME, a Focus Features release.
Credit: Courtesy of TPS Productions/Focus Features © 2025 All Rights Reserved.
One of the comedic highlights of The Phoenician Scheme is Benedict Cumberbatch as Uncle Nubar, an homage in name and look to Nubar Gulbenkian, the magnificently bearded and famously litigious son of Armenian businessman and philanthropist Calouste Gulbenkian.
'We had the great, good fortune that Benedict could come to do the part,' says Anderson.' It's one of those kinds of characters that people in the story keep talking about all along, but who doesn't enter until much later… It is such a familiar story that these men totally neglect their children, who also expect them to achieve more than their peers.'
It's remarkable that one of Cumberbatch's most notable early roles came alongside Richard Ayoade in Chris Morris and Charlie Brooker's cult 2005 sitcom Nathan Barley – and now, 20 years later, here they are starring in The Phoenician Scheme, where Ayoade plays terrorist leader Sergio.
'Richard is an old friend now,' says Anderson. 'It is like that Buñuel thing as well, having a group of terrorists like The Discreet Charm Of The Bourgeoisie. Buñuel has anarchy deep in his personality. I am sure the guerrillas come out of that; this idea that one of the most erudite people you will meet is also the leader of the jungle unit of this militia'.
For all of The Phoenician Scheme's picaresque qualities and witty humour, at the heart of the tale is a recurring theme in Anderson's stories: the attempt to repair damaged family relationships, as Zsa-zsa looks to reconnect with his daughter Liesl. It's an aspect of the story del Toro handles beautifully, and as the director notes, he was always the actor he had in mind.
'The interest for me in writing a story about a character like that was the visual in my mind of Benicio playing the character,' says Anderson. 'The idea for the movie was to write a part specifically for Benicio del Toro. I first brought this up with Benicio in 2021, at Cannes for The French Dispatch. I told him then that something was coming his way if he was interested.
'Benicio and I started working on it very early. As soon as there were 15 pages of the script, he'd seen that. There was never a moment in the process when Benicio was not involved.'
Indeed, as the director further notes, del Toro was the only actor he ever envisioned in the part, at least in the modern era.
'The kind of character who might have been played by Anthony Quinn, or maybe Lino Ventura, or Jean Gabin,' says Anderson. 'If Benicio didn't want to do it, I don't know who would have been a viable option. You'd have to go back into the history of cinema for that.'