Kansas Republican's pleas for decorum at anti-trans hearing met with cries of ‘fascist!'

Yahoo

05-03-2025

Joanna Herrmann testifies Tuesday before the House Education Committee about her experience raising a trans child, and her opposition to legislation that police the use of pronouns in schools. (Kansas Reflector screen capture from Kansas Legislature video)
TOPEKA — Lawrence resident Joanna Herrmann described for lawmakers how shocked she was when her youngest child began to show signs of being 'very different.'
The mother of three, who taught the Bible and considered herself a strong Christian, thought it was a phase. She wasn't supposed to have 'one of those kids,' she said. As parents, she and her ex-husband did everything right.
By the time her child was 3 years old, Herrmann said, she had told her child countless times: 'You are a boy. God made you a boy, and God doesn't makes mistakes.'
'Once I finally began to truly listen and see my child for what she was, I realized, if I'm telling my child that God made her and God doesn't make mistakes, and she continues to feel the way that she does, that means I'm telling my child that she is clearly not the creation of God, and therefore she is the mistake,' Herrmann said. 'I'm proud to say today that my daughter is healthy, happy and a vibrant girl who quite literally spreads sunshine everywhere she goes.'
Herrmann appeared Tuesday before the House Education Committee to speak against Senate Bill 76, which would forbid school employees from using preferred pronouns without written parental consent, and also empower school employees to misgender children regardless of a parent's or child's preference.
Sen. Renee Erickson, R-Wichita, introduced the legislation, which is supported by anti-LGBTQ+ hate groups. The Senate passed the bill 26-14 on Feb. 19.
During Tuesday's hearing in the House, the committee chairwoman, Rep. Susan Estes, R-Wichita, repeatedly urged the room filled with Kansans who oppose the bill to behave politely.
She interrupted and admonished Rabbi Moti Rieber for saying lawmakers were prejudiced toward transgender children. She had Capitol Police forcibly remove Iridescent Roney, who shouted, with a fist in the air, 'Trans rights are human rights.'
'You are disturbing decorum,' Estes said. 'You are trespassing. I am asking you to leave.'
Roney, stumbling with a cane as police shoved her out the door, shouted: 'You're a fascist!'
Estes addressed the overflowing crowd in the committee room: 'Everybody else who has done a very, very good job of maintaining the decorum, I am sorry you had to experience that.'
The meeting began with Estes asserting that in her committee meetings, people are to 'maintain a good tone,' smile, and 'never make anything personal.'
But for Herrmann and more than 100 other opponents who spoke at the hearing or submitted written testimony, the bill is both personal and hurtful.
Herrmann wondered: When did the Legislature decided it needed to police people's names?
'This, to me, is sick and disgusting,' Herrmann said. 'There is another name for people who are obsessed with the genitalia of children. They are called pedophiles. And you are more concerned with what is or isn't between a child's legs than protecting them. You are passing these laws based on fear and control. How incredibly weak of you.'
The legislation is dubbed the 'Given Name Act.'
It would prohibit school employees from addressing a student who is younger than 18 by a pronoun inconsistent with the child's biological sex, or by a name other than the one listed on a birth certificate, without the written permission of the student's parents.
Additionally, school employees and other students couldn't be disciplined for refusing to use a student's desired pronoun or name, regardless of parental consent. This provision applies to colleges and universities as well as K-12 schools, public or private.
Supporters of the bill include Kansas Family Voice, Alliance Defending Freedom, Heritage Foundation and the Kansas Catholic Conference. They argue that the bill buttresses the First Amendment rights of educators to use language that conforms with their religious beliefs.
Melissa Stiehler, of Loud Light Civic Action, told the committee it was 'nonsense' to suggest the bill was about free speech when it actually bans employees from using certain speech.
'The irony here would be pretty funny if it weren't so harmful,' Stiehler said. 'I don't really think that government censorship is much of a laughing matter.'
She told the committee the bill wasn't just harmful — it's also poorly written and unenforceable.
Schools don't have access to birth certificates, she said. And there could be unintended consequences. If a coach refers to a football player by a nickname, like 'the bulldozer,' the coach could get sued, she said, 'which is just ridiculous.'
Rashane Hamby, with the American Civil Liberties Union of Kansas, also questioned how the school was supposed to verify whether a pronoun was consistent with a birth certificate. The legislation is silent on the matter.
'Is the parent submitting a birth certificate to the school staff, the cafeteria, the janitors? We don't know,' Hamby said.
Estes admonished members of the crowd for 'finger-snapping' in support of Hamby's testimony.
Before she was thrown out of the room, Roney testified to the 'tense' political moment for the country.
Roney said she has been targeted and stalked by hate groups for advocating for trans rights.
'America is turning into a fascist state. And if that doesn't set well with you, if you don't want to be called a Nazi later on your life, then you should vote not like a Nazi,' Roney said.
Rieber, the rabbi, talked to lawmakers about the disparity between favorable testimony from out-of-state think tanks and the Kansans who flooded the committee room to oppose the bill.
'These people who come in here and look hopefully at the Legislature and say: 'Look at our lives. Look at our families. Look at the way that we actually live.' And they just ask to be seen, and they ask to be heard.'
But, the rabbi continued, lawmakers have already made a decision on the bill 'before the hearing even starts, and that is so awful.'
To avoid breaking committee rules on decorum, he told lawmakers he wasn't going to plead with them not to ruin lives or legislative out of self-righteousness.
He referenced Senate Bill 63, passed by the Legislature earlier this year with an override of the governor's veto. That bill criminalized gender-affirming care for minors.
'This bill adds insult to the undoubted injury of SB 63. How much more do you want?' Rieber said. 'How much more are you going to do? You've already ruined people's lives.'
He called it 'an evil bill' that legislates 'a particular right-wing Christian understanding' of how to deal with LGBTQ+ students.
Estes warned the crowd not to applaud the rabbi's comments.
Elise Flatland told the committee the legislation would undermine her responsibility as a mother to protect her children.
She said many of the people at her son's school don't know, and don't need to know, his sex assigned at birth or private medical history.
'I'm not asking anyone to accept or understand transgender students,' Flatland said. 'I'm asking for all students to be treated with dignity and respect, especially in the spaces where they should feel the safest. This bill creates an environment where transgender children are more vulnerable to harassment and bullying and prevents the school administration from being able to stop it.'
'This is not a political issue,' she added. 'This is a matter of human dignity. This bill represents another attempt to marginalize and disrespect my family and puts the mental health of my children and children like mine at risk.'
As Flatland finished her testimony, Estes asked the overflowing crowd to remember not to 'display emotion of any kind.'