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Scottish Sun
10-05-2025
- Scottish Sun
How innocent people could be jailed because of sinister AI bot ChatGPT… and leave dangerous criminals walking free
ROBOCOP How innocent people could be jailed because of sinister AI bot ChatGPT… and leave dangerous criminals walking free Click to share on X/Twitter (Opens in new window) Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window) JURORS could secretly be using ChatGPT to decide crunch verdicts, top US lawyers fear. Dean Strang and Jerry Buting, who starred in Netflix documentary Making a Murderer, warned it could see innocent people convicted - or let criminals off the hook. 4 Top lawyers have warned how ChatGPT could be being used to decide verdicts Credit: Reuters 4 Jerry Buting and Dean Strang, who were Steven Avery's defence lawyers The lawyers, who defended Steven Avery on the hit show, insisted it is vital jurors are stopped from accessing the AI tool during trials. Strang said jurors could be tempted to use ChatGPT as a 'sounding board' if they are uncertain about a defendant. But he stressed it could have "disastrous" consequences as jurors could get skewed answers that force a mistrial or bring them to the wrong decision. Strang, who has worked in criminal defence for more than 30 years, told The Sun: 'Jurors should be banned from using ChatGPT. More on AI TRUTH TWISTING AI could jail innocent people with fake CCTV, Making a Murderer lawyer says 'I can't prove this and I'm not a computer engineer, but my sense is that AI, in part, is assessing what it thinks we want to hear and tailoring answers to its perception of what our human wishes and purposes are. 'That would be disastrous in a jury room, to the extent that AI decides the juror is inclined to a conviction. 'You're going to get a skewed answer. To the extent AI perceives the jurors are inclined to acquittal or if AI develops its own will, which I read is at least possible, kind of developing a consciousness. 'Either way, you're getting a skew and neither skew is good, and you're substituting out what you hope is human judgment, a human assessment of what's happening in the courtroom, credibility determinations.' Asked if he fears jurors are already using the tool, or soon will, Strang answered: 'Yes. 'Some never would, and I fear that some would be tempted to or use it as a sounding board, use it as an advisor. China's new cheap AI DeepSeek sparks ALARM as it outperforms West's models like ChatGPT amid race to superintelligence 'Even if the juror says I'm going to make the decision, but I'm getting advice from AI, that's going to be advice that's probably hard to ignore.' Strang and Buting defended Avery in the 2015 documentary, which claimed Avery had been framed for the murder of Teresa Halbach. Avery has been behind bars for the crime since 2007. Before that, he spent 18 years in jail for a rape and attempted murder he was later found innocent of. Strang and Buting continue to maintain his innocence, as does Avery himself. Now, Buting fears even more alleged miscarriages of justice through the use of ChatGPT. Buting, author of Illusion of Justice, told The Sun: 'I've seen people online take situations like the Steven Avery case or the Karen Reed case, a second trial going on right now because the jury was hung, try and use GPT by putting in the facts as they know them. 'Then they ask ChatGPT whether the person is guilty or innocent and they come up with an answer. 'It's bulls*** basically, because it depends on what you put in as the facts. What are the arguments against AI? Artificial intelligence is a highly contested issue, and it seems everyone has a stance on it. Here are some common arguments against it: Loss of jobs - Some industry experts argue that AI will create new niches in the job market, and as some roles are eliminated, others will appear. However, many artists and writers insist the argument is ethical, as generative AI tools are being trained on their work and wouldn't function otherwise. Ethics - When AI is trained on a dataset, much of the content is taken from the internet. This is almost always, if not exclusively, done without notifying the people whose work is being taken. Privacy - Content from personal social media accounts may be fed to language models to train them. Concerns have cropped up as Meta unveils its AI assistants across platforms like Facebook and Instagram. There have been legal challenges to this: in 2016, legislation was created to protect personal data in the EU, and similar laws are in the works in the United States. Misinformation - As AI tools pull information from the internet, they may take things out of context or suffer hallucinations that produce nonsensical answers. Tools like Copilot on Bing and Google's generative AI in search are always at risk of getting things wrong. Some critics argue this could have lethal effects - such as AI prescribing the wrong health information. 'This would be the problem with jurors doing it because jurors listen to the evidence. "If they go back in there and they can't really resolve something themselves, well then that's probably reasonable doubt in most cases. 'But if they say, well, we can't resolve this, you think this and I think that and there's a dispute, let's put it into ChatGPT and see what it says, and then it comes up with an answer, then somebody may be swayed by that. 'AI, at least in its current iteration, has built in biases because of the algorithms.' Buting previously told The Sun he fears AI could destroy the entire justice system by sending innocent people to jail with fake CCTV. ChatGPT exploded onto the scene in 2022 and has since become an essential tool for individuals and businesses worldwide. Buting said: 'We don't know at this point exactly how it's filtering, how it's learning. 'The idea is that it learns from more fact situations presented over and over, but what fact situations, what trials, for instance, is it looking at? 4 Steven Avery listens to testimony in the courtroom at the Calumet County Courthouse in 2007 Credit: AP:Associated Press 4 Jerry Buting argued to jurors that Steven Avery had been framed in Making a Murderer Credit: NETFLIX 'Are there already ones where there has been a built-in bias? Because there is a lot of bias in America's legal system. Bias against minorities in particular. 'So are they kind of underrepresented in the algorithm, machine learning that is happening with AI? A lot of people wonder about that. 'I just know I've seen people use ChatGPT. I can use it and put in facts, and leave out facts that I want to, and it'll come up with an answer probably that I want. 'So I think there's a real problem.' When The Sun asked ChatGPT if Avery was guilty, the response was: "Legally: Steven Avery is guilty, he was convicted and remains in prison. What does the law say? UNDER UK law, judges are allowed to use ChatGPT to assist them when making rulings. AI assistance was given the green light by a landmark ruling in 2023. Guidelines from the Judicial Office sent to thousands of judges across England and Wales said that the tech can be useful for summarising large volumes of text or carrying out administrative tasks. However, it cautions that chatbots should relied upon for researching legal frameworks, because there is a risk it will fabricate cases or legal documents. The guidelines also warn that generative AI technology could be used to create false evidence - such as deepfake pictures or videos. The US is currently grappling with the integration of AI in its legal proceedings. Spearheading progress is the Illinois Supreme Court, which issued guidance on the use of AI by judges and lawyers in December 2024. The document encouraged the responsible and supervised use of AI, and suggested that the use of chatbots in drafting pleadings need not be declared. Its tone is generally pro-AI, and emphasises that existing legal and ethical guidance can be applied. In early May 2025, a federal judicial panel advanced a proposal to seek the public's feedback on a draft rule designed to ensure AI-produced evidence meets the same standards as human evidence. 'Public opinion and expert debate: Divided. Many believe he may have been wrongfully convicted again, especially given the suspicious handling of evidence. 'No definitive proof of innocence or of a frame-up has yet convinced the courts.' It comes as fears continue to be raised about its threat to jobs, and the dangers of the software outsmarting humans. Many experts have also warned of the security dangers of advanced AI – and how cyber-crooks could abuse them to scam innocent victims. The Sun has approached ChatGPT for a response.
The Irish Sun
10-05-2025
- The Irish Sun
How innocent people could be jailed because of sinister AI bot ChatGPT… and leave dangerous criminals walking free
JURORS could secretly be using ChatGPT to decide crunch verdicts, top US lawyers fear. Dean Strang and Jerry Buting, who starred in Netflix documentary Making a Murderer, warned it could see innocent people convicted - or let criminals off the hook. 4 Top lawyers have warned how ChatGPT could be being used to decide verdicts Credit: Reuters 4 Jerry Buting and Dean Strang, who were Steven Avery's defence lawyers The lawyers, who defended Steven Avery on the hit show, insisted it is vital jurors are stopped from accessing the AI tool during trials. Strang said jurors could be tempted to use ChatGPT as a 'sounding board' if they are uncertain about a defendant. But he stressed it could have "disastrous" consequences as jurors could get skewed answers that force a mistrial or bring them to the wrong decision. Strang, who has worked in criminal defence for more than 30 years, told The Sun: 'Jurors should be banned from using ChatGPT. More on AI 'I can't prove this and I'm not a computer engineer, but my sense is that AI, in part, is assessing what it thinks we want to hear and tailoring answers to its perception of what our human wishes and purposes are. 'That would be disastrous in a jury room, to the extent that AI decides the juror is inclined to a conviction. 'You're going to get a skewed answer. To the extent AI perceives the jurors are inclined to acquittal or if AI develops its own will, which I read is at least possible, kind of developing a consciousness. 'Either way, you're getting a skew and neither skew is good, and you're substituting out what you hope is human judgment, a human assessment of what's happening in the courtroom, credibility determinations.' Most read in Tech Asked if he fears jurors are already using the tool, or soon will, Strang answered: 'Yes. 'Some never would, and I fear that some would be tempted to or use it as a sounding board, use it as an advisor. China's new cheap AI DeepSeek sparks ALARM as it outperforms West's models like ChatGPT amid race to superintelligence 'Even if the juror says I'm going to make the decision, but I'm getting advice from AI, that's going to be advice that's probably hard to ignore.' Strang and Buting defended Avery in the 2015 documentary, which claimed Avery had been framed for the murder of Teresa Halbach. Avery has been behind bars for the crime since 2007. Before that, he spent 18 years in jail for a rape and attempted murder he was later found innocent of. Strang and Buting continue to maintain his innocence, as does Avery himself. Now, Buting fears even more alleged miscarriages of justice through the use of ChatGPT. Buting, author of Illusion of Justice, told The Sun: 'I've seen people online take situations like the Steven Avery case or the Karen Reed case, a second trial going on right now because the jury was hung, try and use GPT by putting in the facts as they know them. 'Then they ask ChatGPT whether the person is guilty or innocent and they come up with an answer. 'It's bulls*** basically, because it depends on what you put in as the facts. What are the arguments against AI? Artificial intelligence is a highly contested issue, and it seems everyone has a stance on it. Here are some common arguments against it: Loss of jobs - Some industry experts argue that AI will create new niches in the job market, and as some roles are eliminated, others will appear. However, many artists and writers insist the argument is ethical, as generative AI tools are being trained on their work and wouldn't function otherwise. Ethics - When AI is trained on a dataset, much of the content is taken from the internet. This is almost always, if not exclusively, done without notifying the people whose work is being taken. Privacy - Content from personal social media accounts may be fed to language models to train them. Concerns have cropped up as Meta unveils its AI assistants across platforms like Facebook and Instagram. There have been legal challenges to this: in 2016, legislation was created to protect personal data in the EU, and similar laws are in the works in the United States. Misinformation - As AI tools pull information from the internet, they may take things out of context or suffer hallucinations that produce nonsensical answers. Tools like Copilot on Bing and Google's generative AI in search are always at risk of getting things wrong. Some critics argue this could have lethal effects - such as AI prescribing the wrong health information. 'This would be the problem with jurors doing it because jurors listen to the evidence. "If they go back in there and they can't really resolve something themselves, well then that's probably reasonable doubt in most cases. 'But if they say, well, we can't resolve this, you think this and I think that and there's a dispute, let's put it into ChatGPT and see what it says, and then it comes up with an answer, then somebody may be swayed by that. 'AI, at least in its current iteration, has built in biases because of the algorithms.' Buting previously told The Sun he ChatGPT exploded onto the scene in 2022 and has since become an essential tool for individuals and businesses worldwide. Buting said: 'We don't know at this point exactly how it's filtering, how it's learning. 'The idea is that it learns from more fact situations presented over and over, but what fact situations, what trials, for instance, is it looking at? 4 Steven Avery listens to testimony in the courtroom at the Calumet County Courthouse in 2007 Credit: AP:Associated Press 4 Jerry Buting argued to jurors that Steven Avery had been framed in Making a Murderer Credit: NETFLIX 'Are there already ones where there has been a built-in bias? Because there is a lot of bias in America's legal system. Bias against minorities in particular. 'So are they kind of underrepresented in the algorithm, machine learning that is happening with AI? A lot of people wonder about that. 'I just know I've seen people use ChatGPT. I can use it and put in facts, and leave out facts that I want to, and it'll come up with an answer probably that I want. 'So I think there's a real problem.' When The Sun asked ChatGPT if Avery was guilty, the response was: "Legally: Steven Avery is guilty, he was convicted and remains in prison. What does the law say? UNDER UK law, judges are allowed to use ChatGPT to assist them when making rulings. AI assistance was given the green light by a landmark ruling in 2023. Guidelines from the Judicial Office sent to thousands of judges across England and Wales said that the tech can be useful for summarising large volumes of text or carrying out administrative tasks. However, it cautions that chatbots should relied upon for researching legal frameworks, because there is a risk it will fabricate cases or legal documents. The guidelines also warn that generative AI technology could be used to create false evidence - such as deepfake pictures or videos. The US is currently grappling with the integration of AI in its legal proceedings. Spearheading progress is the Illinois Supreme Court, which issued guidance on the use of AI by judges and lawyers in December 2024. The document encouraged the responsible and supervised use of AI, and suggested that the use of chatbots in drafting pleadings need not be declared. Its tone is generally pro-AI, and emphasises that existing legal and ethical guidance can be applied. In early May 2025, a federal judicial panel advanced a proposal to seek the public's feedback on a draft rule designed to ensure AI-produced evidence meets the same standards as human evidence. 'Public opinion and expert debate: Divided. Many believe he may have been wrongfully convicted again, especially given the suspicious handling of evidence. 'No definitive proof of innocence or of a frame-up has yet convinced the courts.' It comes as fears continue to be raised about its threat to jobs, and the dangers of the software outsmarting humans. Many experts have also warned of the security dangers of advanced AI – and how cyber-crooks could abuse them to The Sun has approached ChatGPT for a response. Who is Steven Avery? STEVEN Avery is serving a life sentence at Wisconsin's Waupun Correctional Institution. He and his nephew He has been fighting for his freedom ever since he was found guilty of murder in 2007. Avery argued that his conviction was based on planted evidence and false testimony. In 1985, It took 18 years for his conviction to be overturned and he was given a $36million (£28.2million) payout in compensation. But days later, he was re-arrested for the murder of The 62-year-old is continuing serving life in prison without the possibility of parole. In the 2015 Netflix original series Making a Murderer, Avery documented his struggle for "justice." In the last episode of the series, viewers were told that Avery had exhausted his appeals and was no longer entitled to state-appointed legal representation.
Global News
06-05-2025
- Health
- Global News
Nova Scotia resident becomes province's 1st measles case in 2 years after U.S. visit
Nova Scotia has confirmed a case of measles in the Halifax Regional Municipality — the first case in the province since 2023. According to chief medical officer of health Dr. Robert Strang, the Nova Scotian had recently travelled to the United States. Public health released a list of possible exposure locations in downtown Halifax, including a hotel, a bar and the Halifax Infirmary ER. 'This person, the length of time of that exposure in the (ER) was thankfully very short given all the steps we've taken for recognition and isolation,' Strang said. 'I want to emphasize … for Nova Scotians not to be alarmed by this. We fully expect this. Our best defence against measles is vaccination.' Strang said the person in this case had previously been immunized with one dose of the vaccine, but that people generally need two doses to be fully vaccinated. Story continues below advertisement Measles is highly contagious and can spread when an infected person breathes, coughs or sneezes. The virus can also linger for hours in the air in a room even after an infected person has left. Strang said that although the disease is extremely contagious, previous cases — an infant in 2023 and two cases in 2017 — didn't result in wide spread. He attributes this to the province's vaccination rate. 'Even though our vaccine rate isn't where it should be, we still have the majority of the people who would have been exposed … immune because of vaccination,' he said. 'So even our current vaccine rates are protecting us to some extent, but we need to make sure people are aware.' Measles cases have been surging in parts of Canada, Mexico and the U.S. Canada's outbreak began last October after a travel-related case in New Brunswick sparked outbreaks there and in Ontario. New Brunswick declared its outbreak over in January, but the virus is still spreading elsewhere in Canada. 12:00 Measles jumps borders: Outbreaks in Canada, Mexico and the U.S. The outbreaks prompted Nova Scotia to hold measles vaccination clinics to inoculate those who may be missing a dose or were unsure of their vaccination status. Story continues below advertisement Over the last month, more than 2,000 people have received the vaccine in these clinics. Get weekly health news Receive the latest medical news and health information delivered to you every Sunday. Sign up for weekly health newsletter Sign Up By providing your email address, you have read and agree to Global News' Terms and Conditions and Privacy Policy Strang said in addition to vaccination, the province is preparing the health-care system by informing providers on recognizing the signs of measles. 'Measles is, unfortunately, becoming more common, but many health-care providers haven't seen measles here. So we're alerting people,' he said. 'We've set up expedited testing pathways within the health system making sure emergency departments are recognizing early and then putting those people in isolation, which is exactly what happened on Sunday (at the ER).' Exposure locations Public health says the person is recovering at home, and the department is directly notifying people who are known to have 'close' contact with the case. 'This will allow us to ensure up-to-date immunization and identify further cases as quickly as possible,' Nova Scotia Health said in a release. People who were at the following locations in Halifax on the specified dates and times should watch for symptoms: Courtyard by Marriott Halifax Downtown, Lobby (5120 Salter St.) on Saturday, April 26 from 10 a.m. to 1 p.m. Banh Mi A & B (6172 Quinpool Rd.) on Saturday, April 26 from 12 p.m. to 2 p.m. Marquee Ballroom/Seahorse Tavern/The Local Restaurant and Bar (2037 Gottingen St.) on Saturday, April 26 from 10:30 p.m. to Sunday, April 27 at 2:30 a.m. Halifax Infirmary Emergency Department (1840 Bell Rd.) on Sunday, May 4 from 8:30 p.m. to 11:15 p.m. Those who were at the ER during those hours on Sunday who are pregnant, immunocompromised or under the age of 12 months should contact public health immediately at 902-481-1697. These people may be eligible for post-exposure prophylaxis (PEP) — a blood product to prevent measles infection. The people who were at the other exposure sites on the April dates are past the date for PEP. Story continues below advertisement Symptoms ca show up between seven and 21 days after exposure. Symptoms of measles include fever, a red blotchy rash, cough, runny nose and white spots on the inside of the mouth and throat. Vaccination Strang stressed that the best protection against measles is vaccination and encouraged Nova Scotians to keep updated on their shots or to get a dose if they were unsure of their vaccination status. In Nova Scotia, people born 1970 to 1995 were offered one dose of measles vaccine as children. He said if they have not had a second dose, they should get one now. Those born in 1996 or later were offered two doses of measles vaccine but should get fully vaccinated now if they missed one or both doses. Public health also recommends that infants six to 11 months of age receive a single dose of measles vaccine if they are travelling outside of Canada. People born in 1969 or earlier are generally considered immune but can consider receiving a single dose of measles vaccine if travelling outside of Canada. Strang said the latest data shows the vaccination rate for children is in the mid-80s. 'For many other vaccines, we'd be very happy with that kind of coverage rate. But there are some gaps that make us more vulnerable, so we have some work to do,' Strang said. Story continues below advertisement 'As we grow our province, have more people coming from around the world to live here, one of the things we are focused on is how do we make sure those children coming here — we get them opportunities to get up to date with a Nova Scotia vaccine schedule.'
Yahoo
06-05-2025
- Entertainment
- Yahoo
Zach Bryan Scores $350 Million in Blockbuster Label, Publishing Deals
In a pair of blockbuster deals totaling $350 million, Zach Bryan has re-upped with Warner Records and, separately, either has sold or is in the process of selling his publishing catalog, sources tell Variety. Bryan's team had long been negotiating with Warner, but the recorded-music deal, which sources say is for at least two albums, was just concluded Sunday night. While it was clear that Warner was determined to keep him — despite Bryan's social media post in January about releasing 'one final major label album' — the company faced stiff competition from Universal. More from Variety Tim Hinshaw's Free Lunch Agency Partners With Warner Records, Launches Label With Signees Syd and Alex Isley Mike Chester Promoted to General Manager of Warner Records Blackpink's Jisoo Signs With Warner Records for Solo Releases Sources say the buyer of the publishing catalog is a new entity, apparently called the Merrit Group, that is helmed by Cameron Strang, who was previously CEO of both Warner Bros. Records and Warner Chappell Music publishing, although details about the company and the deal are unclear. Strang left Warner Chappell in 2015 and the label two years later, and has largely kept a low profile in the music industry since then. He had launched the Americana-leaning indie label New West in 1998 and Southside Independent Publishing in 2004, the latter of which was acquired by Warner Chappell in 2010, shortly before he took over that company. Reps for Bryan, Strang, Warner and Bryan's attorney David Jacobs declined or did not respond to Variety's requests for comment. The new label deal was first reported by the Hollywood Reporter. Bryan, one of the biggest recording artists in the world, has been Warner Records' top performer for nearly three years, beginning with the success of his 2022 breakthrough album, 'American Heartbreak.' He signed with Warner, in partnership with his own Belting Bronco label, shortly after he was honorably discharged from the U.S. Navy in 2021, having released his first two albums independently while he was still in the service. Since then he has risen rapidly to a stadium-level artist, with three multiplatinum studio albums that spawned hit singles like 'Something in the Orange,' 'Pink Skies' and the Kacey Musgraves duet 'I Remember Everything.' He also has released a pair of live albums. This summer, Bryan will headline AEG's massive Hyde Park BST festival in London, and just a few weeks later will perform at the 107,000-capacity Michigan Stadium. Bryan teased an upcoming film in the same post as the 'final' major label album via a voice note from actor Matthew McConaughey. In a clip posted to Instagram, Bryan enlists McConaughey to announce the film 'Motorbreath,' which he suggests will document Bryan and his friends recording his final album for Warner Records. 'This is not a film about a band,' says McConaughey. 'This is a film about a boy from Oklahoma, a boy who joined the Navy with a love of writing. That writing connected with people — a lot of people. This film is about a group of best friends taking a two-week motorcycle ride across America while recording one final major label album. Oh, and the title of the film, you ask? 'Motorbreath.'' Best of Variety Emmy Predictions: Talk/Scripted Variety Series - The Variety Categories Are Still a Mess; Netflix, Dropout, and 'Hot Ones' Stir Up Buzz Oscars Predictions 2026: 'Sinners' Becomes Early Contender Ahead of Cannes Film Festival New Movies Out Now in Theaters: What to See This Week Sign in to access your portfolio
Yahoo
26-03-2025
- Politics
- Yahoo
As higher ed faces attack, Ohio State, Johns Hopkins presidents address role in democracy
What is the role of the American research university? How should they educate and prepare students to be engaged citizens? And how should universities leaders engage in this moment when many say that higher education is under attack? Ohio State President Ted Carter and Johns Hopkins University President Ronald J. Daniels aimed to answer those questions during a public discussion at the Ohio Union Tuesday afternoon. The discussion, called "Citizenship Education at America's Leading Research Universities," was the first public event held by Ohio State's Salmon P. Chase Center for Civics, Culture & Society and was co-sponsored by the Center for Ethics and Human Values, the Institute for Democratic Engagement and Accountability and the John Glenn College of Public Affairs. Study up on education news: Subscribe to The Dispatch's weekly education newsletter Extra Credit Though the Ohio General Assembly mandated the creation of five independent academic centers promoting intellectual diversity at Ohio State and four other state public universities in 2023, and the center has been active since this past fall, Tuesday's event was in some ways a public introduction to the Chase Center and its offerings. Chase Center Executive Director Lee J. Strang moderated the hourlong event. Strang said the purpose of the event was two-fold: to provide information about citizenship education at the university level and to model civil debate. Carter and Daniels both shared their perspectives as leaders of public and private universities, respectively, on how what they see as the role of a research university in promoting civic education. It is a question that Strang was particularly interested in hearing from Daniels. Daniels, who has served as president of Johns Hopkins since 2009, wrote a book titled "What Universities Owe Democracy" in 2021. Strang read the book three years ago, about the same time that discussions started at the Statehouse related to creating the Chase Center and other like it. He thought it was interesting why the president of the country's leading research institution would write a book about citizenship education. The two concepts are more intertwined than one might think, Daniels said during Tuesday's discussion. He took attendees back to post-WW2 America, when inventor and science administrator Vannevar Bush led the movement responsible for creating the National Science Foundation. His push to promote national security and economic growth by financing higher education research through federal funds, Daniels said, was "true genius." That relationship between the university and the federal government is crucial to the growth and existence of not only high-level research but also democracy itself, both presidents said. Ohio State, Carter said, wouldn't exist without its research arm. "As a public (university), we are beholden to those dollars for us to be able to do this work for the nation," Carter said. "The United States has a gift for the future and the current work of research." Both presidents submitted, however, that universities need to do a better job communicating all of the work they do and why it is crucial to civic engagement. A Gallup poll published in July 2024 found that Americans are nearly equally divided on their confidence levels in higher education. Those who have a lot of confidence in higher education, about 36%, just barely outweighs those who have some confidence (32%) and those with little or no confidence (32%) in higher education. That is in stark contrast to when Gallup first measured confidence in higher education in 2015, when 57% had a great deal or quite a lot of confidence and only 10% had little or none. "It's a little bit under attack, to be quite honest, right now," Carter said. "But what it is that we do and how we do it is so important." Daniels said that we've seen democracies around the world "drifting to authoritarianism" and "robust democracies becoming fragile." "It's in that context that you ask the question, 'What can institutions do to ensure the survival and the flourishing of these political arrangements, of these institutions that we associate with the idea of democracy?'" he said. Education, both Daniels and Carter said, is a huge part of the solution. Both shared how they've worked to integrate civics education at their universities. At Johns Hopkins, Daniels said the university started "Democracy Day," a full day of programming during freshman orientation where new students hear all about the tenets of democracy, learn about opportunities across campus and in the broader community to get involved, and participate in activities to cultivate and practice civil discourse. "We're trying to normalize this exchange, and again, be a corrective force to the deep polarization that exists in this country," Daniels said. "We're deeply, deeply divided, but we're not even talking to each other. We're just hurling insults and getting more and more entrenched... This is an opportunity to develop this ability to navigate these differences." Carter noted that "Education for Citizenship" is both Ohio State's motto and its mission. He highlighted the university's Listen. Learn. Discuss. platform, launched during fall semester. The platform acts as an umbrella to campus groups dedicated to free expression and civics, including the Center for Ethics and Human Values, OSU Votes and the Divided Community Project. Civil discourse: These Ohio State academics want to help you navigate difficult conversations better It was almost fitting that an event about education did not take place without its detractors. About halfway through the discussion, two students seated in the audience stood up and called on Carter to join them at a protest outside the Ohio Union to hear directly from students. About 50 students gathered before the Chase Center event to protest the university's recent decision to shutter two of its diversity offices, as well as the state of university's investments and student housing. "We have students, faculty and staff who are concerned about the lack of democracy at Ohio State University," one of the students said. "... We want you to embody the citizenship you're talking about here." The protestors were escorted out of the theater minutes later without issue. Before resuming the event, Carter said to audience members that he is proud that students feel comfortable expressing their freedom of speech on campus. "As I said earlier, I wore the uniform for 38 years. I was committed to the Constitution of the United States, and part of that was First Amendment," he said. "So as much as it seems like a disruption, it's OK, and that's part of what we do here." Higher education reporter Sheridan Hendrix can be reached at shendrix@ and on Signal at @sheridan.120. You can follow her on Instagram at @sheridanwrites. This article originally appeared on The Columbus Dispatch: Ohio State, Johns Hopkins leaders speak at Chase Center's first event
