Senate Republicans weigh billions of dollars in spending cuts
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Taylor Wilson:
Good morning. I'm Taylor Wilson, and today is Wednesday, July 16th, 2025. This is USA TODAY's The Excerpt. Today Senate Republicans weigh billions of dollars in spending cuts, plus hear how some immigrants are raising funds to cover legal expenses. And after 80 years, Trinity test atom bomb victims will receive reparations.
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Senate Republicans are weighing billions in spending cuts targeting programs from PBS to global health initiatives in response to a request from President Donald Trump. The proposal to claw back about $9 billion in federal funding reflects a portion of the cuts pursued by the Department of Government Efficiency. The bill currently under consideration would impact the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, which funds NPR and PBS, and foreign aid agencies, including the World Health Organization and US Agency for International Development. Lawmakers have until Friday before Trump's request officially expires and current funding remains in place. From GoFundMe to OnlyFans, immigrants are going to new lengths to raise funds to cover legal fees. I spoke with USA TODAY National Immigration and Border Reporter Lauren Villagran for more. Thanks for joining me, Lauren.
Lauren Villagran:
Thanks Taylor.
Taylor Wilson:
All right. So just starting with this, how are immigrants turning to GoFundMe to pay for deportation defense? And why is this necessary?
Lauren Villagran:
This is something I've been watching for a while, from the very beginning of the ramped up enforcement that we've seen under the administration of President Donald Trump. But in the past few months, it really does seem to have accelerated. You're seeing more fundraising, more frequent campaigns, and larger sums of money. A USA TODAY analysis of GoFundMe fundraising campaigns this year found nearly 100 different campaigns set up by the loved ones of people detained by ICE, or community members, raising in just the last three or four months, $1.7 million.
Taylor Wilson:
All right. And how about OnlyFans? I know there's, I guess, a similar approach that we're seeing there.
Lauren Villagran:
I met a man who was visiting his wife, who was detained in South Florida by ICE and sent to a Louisiana detention center. And they, like many immigrant families around the country, are struggling under the weight of the cost of deportation defense and the legal process to stay in the country. They went to OnlyFans, the adult content site. The husband, who wishes to remain anonymous, as does his wife, who is from Colombia, decided to upload some of their own personal content and photos of her to the adult content site in hopes of generating subscriptions that could help pay her bond.
Taylor Wilson:
Lauren, you write that public generosity to the fundraisers appears to be growing as the president's mass deportation campaign has intensified. I guess these folks are having some success raising money in this way?
Lauren Villagran:
So there was definitely a marked difference between fundraisers started in June and July on GoFundMe versus those from April and May, which generated in some cases sort of lower level of funding. In June and July, you start to see fundraisers get over $100,000 in donations. I spoke with one advocate in Kentucky who was looking to raise money for the defense of a young man, a recent high school graduate. He was a refugee. He was here in the country legally, and was still picked up by ice. She decided to hit send on the GoFundMe campaign, and within 48 hours had raised more than $20,000 for him. He was eventually released back into his community, but it certainly something that family members, loved one's, community members are looking to do, because Taylor, bond can range from $1,500 to over $10,000.
Taylor Wilson:
Lauren, what else do you hear from migrants about their fundraising experiences in some of these spaces?
Lauren Villagran:
So US Immigration and Customs Enforcement under the Trump administration has prioritized for arrest anyone who is in the country illegally, and in some cases those who may be in a legal process but without firm status. There's a variety of stories. Everything from the student who had recently graduated high school to a Mexican father of 11 who was picked up on the way to his drywall business in North Carolina. He was eventually released. GoFundMe helped him get the $4,000 he needed to pay that bond. And then in the case of this couple, the American man from South Florida and his Colombian wife, well, it's a shot in the dark, but they are turning to essentially an adult content site. So the desperation is real among some of these families. The Department of Homeland Security did not respond to a request for comment on fundraising for legal defense for immigrants from USA TODAY, but the department has been very clear about the scope of its enforcement.
Taylor Wilson:
Did you hear from GoFundMe or OnlyFans about their respective roles in these spaces?
Lauren Villagran:
We did not hear back from OnlyFans. We know really of only one immigrant detained woman who is using the site for this purpose at this point. GoFundMe declined to comment on any increase in fundraising related to immigration defense, but did work with USA TODAY to verify more than a dozen accounts related to immigration detention fundraising.
Taylor Wilson:
All right. Lauren Villagran covers the border and immigration for USA TODAY. Listeners can find a link to the full version of this story in today's show notes. Thank you, Lauren.
Lauren Villagran:
Thanks Taylor.
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Taylor Wilson:
Today marks 80 years since the Trinity test. And more Americans are now eligible for compensation for health problems linked to radiation exposure from the Atomic Weapons Program. I spoke with USA TODAY Breaking News Reporter Karissa Waddick to learn more. Karissa, thanks for joining me today.
Karissa Waddick:
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Taylor Wilson:
Let's go back to the Trinity test. What kind of exposure did folks in this area face?
Karissa Waddick:
So the Trinity test, as you know, was the first time a nuclear bomb was ever detonated. It was detonated in an area of New Mexico that scientists thought was pretty remote, pretty isolated from people, and they chose the location because of the relatively predictable wind patterns. They also kept the test completely secret, even to residents in the area. And so there are a lot of stories out there of people who heard the thunderous roar that morning, July the 16th 1945. And the flash of light, and they looked from their yards, and they saw this giant mushroom cloud in the sky. And they had no clue what it was. The reports talk about this flower-like debris falling on everything. And that was actually radioactive material. It fell into crops, into water supplies, onto laundry lines, everything. So people ingested these radioactive materials and became sick years later. Within the next couple of decades, people living in these areas of New Mexico, within 40 or so miles of the test site became sick with rare forms of cancer and other serious illnesses.
Taylor Wilson:
So Karissa, the government publicly downplayed the potential consequences of the nuclear bomb test for people in this area, right? I mean, how so?
Karissa Waddick:
They kept it completely secret. Nobody was told before it happened, and nobody knew really what it was until after the US dropped the atomic bomb a month later on Hiroshima in Japan. The day of the test, the military said the explosion involved pyrotechnics. But in the initial reports after the test, there was this physicist who was in charge of the safety aspects for personnel on site. And he said in a letter to one of the military officials that radiation was found near homes. He recommended that the next test be conducted at least 150 miles away from populated areas. And to give some context on that, hundreds of thousands of people lived within the 150-mile range of the Trinity test. And so it wasn't until 1979, it was actually elite Senator Edward Kennedy from Massachusetts who said during a hearing in Congress that the federal government had minimized the effect of the fallout from the Trinity test for years. And some of these reports came out.
Taylor Wilson:
Who did you speak with for this story Karissa, and what did you take away from those conversations?
Karissa Waddick:
I spoke with some descendants of people who live in the Tularosa Basin in New Mexico, which was about 40 miles away from the test site. There's this one woman, Edna K. Hinkle, her father Jess, who is still alive, he's 94 years old. He lived in the Tularosa Basin, and he was 14 years old when the bomb went off. Fast-forward years later, and at least 25 members of Hinkle's family descended from her father and his five siblings have had some form of cancer, from thyroid cancer to stomach cancer, breast cancer, skin cancer. Edna, she had beat breast cancer, and had seven skin cancers, and had her thyroid removed at the recommendation of a doctor who said that it was better to remove it in case it became cancerous later.
Taylor Wilson:
A measure in the recently enacted Republican tax bill expands who is eligible for a program that compensates people who have health problems linked to radiation exposure from the Atomic Weapons Program. What can you tell us about this recent development?
Karissa Waddick:
You're exactly right. Congress passed the Radiation Exposure Compensation Act a couple of decades ago, but it previously only applied to people who are living in certain parts of Nevada, Utah, and Arizona. And it didn't include people who are impacted by the Trinity test in New Mexico, or some uranium miners who are living on Navajo lands in Arizona and some other areas. So the new law expands the number of people who are eligible to a slew of new states. It includes all of Utah, New Mexico and Idaho, and more people living in Nevada, Arizona, Missouri, Tennessee, Kentucky, and Alaska. And it also includes a number of other people who worked in uranium mines as well throughout the later part of the 20th century. And the new act also increases the amount of compensation, so people who are eligible could receive up to $100,000 from the federal government for the health related problems that were linked to the exposure.
Taylor Wilson:
All right. Well, I want to get a better sense of the tangible impact on the lives of some of these folks. What impact will this money have on their lives, Karissa? What did you hear from some folks you spoke with?
Karissa Waddick:
Edna, who I spoke about earlier, she mentioned just how many people this affects in her area of New Mexico. And she talked about how that area is relatively poor. New Mexico is one of the poorest states in the country, and people there to pay for their medical bills can be difficult sometimes. And I mentioned that one of her neighbors needed to pull together money to take a car ride up to Albuquerque to get medical treatment. She said that the $100,000 would be life-changing. It would essentially feel like millions of dollars to some people in this area.
Taylor Wilson:
Important story here. Folks should go check out the full version with the link in today's show notes. Karissa Waddick covers breaking news for USA TODAY. Thanks, Karissa.
Karissa Waddick:
Thanks so much.
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Taylor Wilson:
It's nearly 10 billion light years away, and you won't see it in the night sky, but the collision of two massive black holes detected in 2023 has created a third one, with 225 times the mass of our sun, the largest black hole merger ever charted. The event has astrophysicists, rewriting record books and rethinking theories on how objects form in space. The collision is especially noteworthy, because the two black holes were larger than those in previous collisions. The two black holes were spinning at about 400 times faster than the Earth's rotation when they collided billions of years ago. You can read more with an awesome graphic story by clicking a link in today's show notes.
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The Emmy nominations are here. Drama Severance led the way with 27 nods followed by The Penguin with 24, and The Studio and The White Lotus tied for third place. Meanwhile, eighty-three-year-old Harrison Ford earned his first Emmy nod for his role as the ornery therapist on the show Shrinking. There were plenty left on the outside though, including Squid Game. The massively popular show was an Emmy darling in its first season, grabbing a best drama series nomination and a trophy for star Lee Jung-jae. But the second season of the series, which streamed in December of 2024, couldn't score a nomination in a single category. You can take a look at some of our nomination takeaways with a link in today's show notes.
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And later today, discussions of body positivity online have shifted back toward unrealistic weight loss goals, despite efforts by TikTok and other platforms to ban such content.
Alyssa Goldberg:
Now it feels like with the skinny talk, the skinny influencer, it's becoming more normalized again to be able to show this desire for thinness and go to extreme measures to get there.
Taylor Wilson:
USA TODAY Wellness Reporter Alyssa Goldberg sits down with my colleague Dana Taylor, to look at how diet culture is evolving, and why it's newest trends on social media are even harder to stop. You can hear their conversation today, beginning at four PM Eastern Time right here on this feed.
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And thanks for listening to The Excerpt. You can get the podcast wherever you get your audio, and if you're on a smart speaker, just ask for The Excerpt. I'm Taylor Wilson, and I'll be back tomorrow with more of The Excerpt from USA TODAY.
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Transcripts Meet the Press — July 27, 2025 Rep. Ro Khanna (D-Calif.), Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.), Rep. Mike Johnson (R) Speaker of the House, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), Peter Baker, Former Rep. Carlos Curbelo (R-Fla.), Jeh Johnson, and Amna Nawaz
KRISTEN WELKER: This Sunday: Mounting pressure. REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES: What are they hiding from the American people? KRISTEN WELKER: The fight to release the Justice Department's Jeffrey Epstein files grows—touching a political nerve and triggering a pain point for Republicans. SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: There is no daylight between the house Republicans, the House, and the president on maximum transparency. REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE: People want information. They don't want things covered up. SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER: Speaker Johnson has assured that August has become 'the Epstein recess' KRISTEN WELKER: The House leaves for an early recess, as President Trump shifts blame to the Democrats. PRES. DONALD TRUMP: After what they did to me, and whether it's right or wrong, it's time to go after people. KRISTEN WELKER: My guests this morning: Speaker of the House Mike Johnson, Republican Senator Lindsey Graham, and a joint interview with Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna and Republican Congressman Thomas Massie. Plus, building tensions. As President Trump turns up the heat on the Fed Chair—Powell pushes back. PRES. DONALD TRUMP: Looks like it's about 3.1 billion, went up a little bit or a lot, so the 2.7 is now 3.1. FED. CHAIR JEROME POWELL: I'm not aware of that, Mr. President. PRES. DONALD TRUMP Yeah, it just came out. FED. CHAIR JEROME POWELL: You just added in a third building, is what that is. KRISTEN WELKER: And, hunger crisis. As ceasefire negotiations fall apart, warnings of mass starvation spreading inside Gaza. Joining me for insight and analysis are: New York Times Chief White House Correspondent Peter Baker, Amna Nawaz, co-anchor of PBS NewsHour, former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson, and former Republican Congressman Carlos Curbelo. Welcome to Sunday, it's Meet the Press. ANNOUNCER: From NBC News in Washington, the longest-running show in television history, this is Meet the Press with Kristen Welker. KRISTEN WELKER: Good Sunday morning. President Trump is waking up at his golf resort in Scotland this weekend, but unable to shake the controversy that is increasingly engulfing his White House back at home— those growing calls for his administration to release all of the files related to Jeffrey Epstein. Epstein was a financier convicted of sex crimes and facing federal sex trafficking charges when he was found dead in his jail cell in 2019, ruled a suicide. On the campaign trail, Mr. Trump said he would release the Epstein files. [BEGIN TAPE] RACHEL CAMPOS-DUFFY: Would you declassify the Epstein files? PRES. DONALD TRUMP: Yeah. Yeah, I would. I guess I would. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: But now his administration is backtracking—creating a backlash from Democrats and for the first time from many in his own base. The president facing mounting questions about his relationship with Epstein—trying to shift the focus. [BEGIN TAPE] PRES. DONALD TRUMP: You're making a very big thing over something that's not a big thing. Don't talk about Trump. What you should be talking about is the fact that we have the greatest six months in the history of a presidency. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: This week the Wall Street Journal reported that back in 2003 Mr. Trump contributed to a collection of letters to Epstein for his 50th birthday, allegedly writing a 'bawdy' letter to Epstein which included an outline of a naked woman. The president has forcefully denied he wrote the letter and is now suing the Journal. [BEGIN TAPE] Do you maintain you did not write a letter for Jeffrey Epstein's birthday book? PRES. DONALD TRUMP: I don't even know what they're talking about. Now, somebody could have written a letter and used my name, but that's happened a lot. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: The Journal also reported that Attorney General Pam Bondi informed Mr. Trump during a May briefing that his name appeared in Justice Department documents related to Epstein. While the White House confirms that meeting happened, the president denies being told his name appears in the files. [BEGIN TAPE] REPORTER: Mr. President, were you briefed on your name appearing in Epstein files ever? PRES. DONALD TRUMP: No, I was never, never briefed, no. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: Being named in the files is not evidence of wrongdoing. And Epstein's one-time girlfriend Ghislaine Maxwell who is serving a 20-year sentence, convicted of assisting his sex trafficking ring, including luring and abusing young women herself – answered questions from DOJ officials for two straight days. Prompting the question – would the president pardon her? When Mr. Trump was pressed, he didn't rule it out. [BEGIN TAPE] PRES. DONALD TRUMP: It's something I haven't thought about, it's really something, it's something – I'm allowed to do it. But it's something I have not thought about. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: All as the drumbeat for the release of the Epstein files continues to grow louder and as Republican infighting over the potential disclosure has reached a fever pitch. [BEING TAPE] REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE: People want the information. They don't want things covered up, especially when it comes to the most well known convicted pedophile in modern day history. It's important to them, and they really want the information out. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: And joining me now, a bipartisan duo who is teaming up to force a House vote demanding the release of the Epstein files. Republican Congressman Thomas Massie of Kentucky, and Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California, welcome to Meet the Press to both of you. REP. THOMAS MASSIE: Thank you. REP. RO KHANNA: Thank you. KRISTEN WELKER: Thank you both so much for being here. I want to start with a question for both of you. House Speaker Mike Johnson, who will be my next guest, has accused you of being hypocritical for pushing for the release of these files now and not when former President Biden was in office. Take a listen to what he had to say. [BEGIN TAPE] SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Remember, President Biden and his DOJ had these files for four years. Neither of those guys said a word about it. Thomas Massie is suggesting that this is some sort of watershed moment. We are all on the same page trying to advance the truth, the full truth and transparency. And the idea that he's suddenly so concerned about it is curious to me. He waited until President Trump was elected to bring this– MAJOR GARRETT: Hypocritical? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Seems that way to me. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: Congressman Khanna, let me start with you first. Why are you pushing for the release of the Epstein files now and not during President Biden's administration? REP. RO KHANNA: Well, Speaker Johnson's a friend. We came into Congress together. But I hope he'll join us for transparency. Actually in 2019 I tweeted out that I was working with Elijah Cummings to have a full investigation of the Epstein situation and the deaths associated with it. Then in 2021 and in 2024, the courts started to release Epstein files. Then you had a situation where the president of the United States, President Trump says when he's president, "We're going to release all the files." Then Pam Bondi says that there's a client list. There may not be a client list. But we're going to release all the files." I didn't say anything while giving him the benefit of doubt in the first few months. What triggered this is Pam Bondi issuing a memo saying, "There's nothing more to be seen," after saying that there was an Epstein file and a list. And that's what triggered this crisis of trust. That's why we need a full disclosure now and why I have teamed up with Representative Massie and 11 other prominent Republicans to demand that. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, Congressman Massie, let me turn to you. What say you? Are you being hypocritical by demanding this now and not sooner? REP. THOMAS MASSIE: No, not at all. Look, the release of the Epstein files is emblematic of what Trump ran for and why he got the populist vote. There seems to be a class of people beyond the law, beyond the judicial system that operates outside of all of that. And we all thought that when Trump was elected, he would be the bull in the china shop and that he would break that up and bring transparency. Frankly, it wasn't until just recently that I realized that people who were allegedly working on this weren't sincere in their efforts. And also, politics is the art of the doable. There's enough public pressure right now that we can get 218 votes and force this to a vote on the floor. Somebody should ask Speaker Mike Johnson, 'Why did he recess Congress early so that he didn't have to deal with the Epstein issue?' He can bring this to the floor at any point. Yet he's chosen to send us home early for August recess. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, Congressman Massie, let me delve into this with you. We will get to Johnson in just a moment. But the Department of Justice says they will not be releasing further Epstein material in order to protect what they say is more than 1,000 victims, many of whom were underage. I want to read you a little bit of a DOJ memo which writes, quote, "Sensitive information relating to these victims is intertwined throughout the materials. One of our highest priorities is combating child exploitation and bringing justice to victims. Perpetuating unfounded theories about Epstein serves neither one of those ends." What is your response to the concern that releasing these files could ultimately hurt the victims, Congressman Massie? REP. THOMAS MASSIE: Well, look, that's a straw man. Ro and I carefully crafted this legislation so that the victims' names will be redacted and that no child pornography will be released. So they're hiding behind that. But we're trying to get justice for the victims and transparency for America. And so, you know, we've redacted things before. We don't want to hurt the victims. We're doing this for the victims. I think it's just something that they're hiding behind. And in the end of that statement I heard something about conspiracy theories or something like that. Look, they're the ones – it's the president's own attorney general, FBI director, and children who said – and vice president who said that these files need to be released. We're just trying to hold their feet to the fire. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, and Congressman Khanna, take another piece of this based on what you are proposing in this legislation, the names of frankly anyone who flew on Jeffrey Epstein's planes or visited any of his properties, anyone named in the files who was not a victim will likely be publicly released if these files are released. Is it fair to release files that may never see their day in court but could be devastating, quite frankly, to the people mentioned in them? REP. RO KHANNA: Kristen, that is a fair question. But I want to just focus first on the victims. Bradley Edwards, was the lawyer for the victims, has demanded a full release of the files, obviously with the victims' names redacted. He said the Justice Department has never cared about the victims – about centering the victims. They gave Jeffrey Epstein the plea deal in the first place. They never cared about victims rights. And no one has asked the victims what they want. They do want these files released for closure and for healing. Now there's a reason the Justice Department usually doesn't release information before charging people. And I understand the sensitivity of that. But in this case, given that this has created a trust in our very government itself. Different people feel that the rich and the powerful have been not held accountable, that they have a different set of rules, and that there may be government officials involved. There possibly could be foreign government involved, business involved, financial fraud involved. The president should say, "I ran on this. The attorney general promised this. We're going to do a clean, full release." And I think the American people are fair. They're going to be able to distinguish between someone who got a grant from Jeffrey Epstein to do cancer research versus rich and powerful men who were abusing underage girls. KRISTEN WELKER: Congressman Massie, I do want to go back to the fact that House was adjourned early. House Speaker Mike Johnson has defended that decision. He says, "Look, the White House is already pushing for the release of the grand jury materials." Obviously that's been held up in court. He's accusing you of trying to inflict political pain on your party by criticizing him for adjourning the House early. Is he right? Are you trying to inflict political pain with this criticism? REP. THOMAS MASSIE: I don't know why it should be politically painful to be transparent. Is the pain he's talking about that somebody in our party will be embarrassed by those files? Then that's not a good excuse. Is the pain he's talking about that is that the legislators when they vote have to pick between protecting embarrassment of the rich and powerful versus getting justice for victims? I don't really understand what he means by that. Why is it painful for Mike Johnson to call a vote on this? And, you know, the American people deserve this regardless of what the political ramifications are for the speaker. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, let's talk about Ghislaine Maxwell now. Of course, she sat for two days of interviews with DOJ officials. President Trump was asked, does he want to pardon her? He said he hasn't thought about it but he's allowed to do it. Congressman Massie, first to you. Would you support a pardon or commutation of Ghislaine Maxwell? REP. THOMAS MASSIE: You know, that would be up to the president. But if she has information that could help us, then I think she should testify. Let's get that out there. And whatever they need to do to compel that testimony, as long as it's truthful, I would be in favor of. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, Congressman Khanna, I mean, look at her record. Convicted of sex trafficking of a minor, sex trafficking conspiracy, the list goes on and on. Do you think Ghislaine Maxwell should be pardoned or have a commutation of her sentence, her 20-year sentence? REP. RO KHANNA: No, I don't. And I'm concerned that the Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche is meeting with her supposedly one-on-one. Look, I agree with Congressman Massie that she should testify. But she's been indicted twice on perjury. This is why we need the files. This is why we need independent evidence. But by the way, the only person who suffered political pain in this whole thing is Congressman Thomas Massie for telling the truth. He's got the president's entire team who got the president reelected coming down on him in his district. And it's just made him stronger. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, Congressman Khanna, I have to ask you politically speaking, the implication for Democrats, there has been a lot of focus by yourself, by other Democrats on this issue of Jeffrey Epstein. Prior to this, you all were talking about the so-called 'Big Beautiful Bill', the fact that the CBO has estimated for example some 10 million people could be kicked off of their health care. Are you concerned that by focusing on Epstein, you could overshadow Democrats' message on pocketbook issues and hurt your chances in the midterms? REP. RO KHANNA: No I'm not. Look, my core conviction is a new economic patriotism to re-industrialize America, a 21st century Marshall Plan for America, Medicare for all, opposing the Medicaid cuts. But you can't do anything constructive with government if you don't have trust in government. This is about trust in government. When John F. Kennedy was president, trust in government was 60%. Today it's in the teens. Speaker Johnson and I came to Congress together. He was on the reform side too. He wanted to make government work. This is a perfect opportunity for him to say, "Look, the past is the past." Okay, I didn't love that he shut down government. Maybe on your show today he'll commit that when we come back, let's have a vote. Remind him of what we were like, the conversations we had in our freshman class. This is about being a reform agent of transparency. KRISTEN WELKER: Very quickly before I let you both go. First Congressman Massie to you. Will this pass? Will it come to the floor and pass the House when you return from August recess? REP. THOMAS MASSIE: Well, I hope it does because, you know, the question you asked Ro, this is going to hurt Republicans in the midterms. The voters will be apathetic if we don't hold the rich and powerful accountable. I think when we get back, we can get the signatures required to force this to the floor, Speaker Mike Johnson should do the right thing and just bring it to the floor and not require us to force it. And he'll have a choice once we get those 218 signatures. Is he going to try and change the rules of the House of Representatives mid-stream or not? If he does, that becomes the vote for the American people. KRISTEN WELKER: Congressman Khanna, I'm out of time. But yes or no, will it pass? REP. RO KHANNA: It will pass. KRISTEN WELKER: All right, there you go. Congressmen, thank you so much for joining us for this conversation. We really appreciate it. Thank you so much. And when we come back, Speaker of the House Mike Johnson joins me next. KRISTEN WELKER: Welcome back. Joining me now is House Speaker Mike Johnson of Louisiana. Speaker Johnson, welcome back to Meet the Press. SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Great to be with you. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, it is great to have you. You just heard my conversation with Congressman Massie, Congressman Khanna. So let me start off with this question. Why did you adjourn the House early? And does it run the risk of feeding the perception that there's something to hide in the Epstein matter? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Look, these are all important questions. Let me be absolutely clear as we have been from the very beginning. House Republicans insist upon the release of all credible evidence and information related to Epstein in any way. But we are also insisting upon the protection of innocent victims. And our concern is that the Massie and Khanna discharge petition is reckless in the way that it is drafted and presented. It does not adequately include those protections. And I can explain all the details of that. With the important thing on the timing, to answer that question first, is that we did not do anything to end the term of Congress early. The Massie-Khanna discharge petition was filed so that it would not ripen until a day after Congress had previously been scheduled for almost a year to be out of session and in the district work period for August. And that is the timing of it. So what we did do this week is end the chaos in the Rules Committee because the Democrats are trying to use this in a shameless manner for political purposes, quite obviously. They hijacked the Rules Committee. And they tried to turn it into an Epstein hearing. That's not what the Rules Committee is about. So that's why the floor votes ended on Wednesday instead of Thursday. But the work of Congress continues. And the schedule of Congress was published well over a year ago, December of 2024. So none of this was a surprise. And Khanna and Massie could have brought their discharge petition a day earlier and prevented that or, as noted earlier, any time over the last four years. They did not do it during the Biden administration. And that's an important point for everybody to note. KRISTEN WELKER: But Mr. Speaker, it's not just Republicans supporting this, it's 11 — it's not just Democrats, it's 11 Republicans as well. Let me just ask you because I hear you saying that, yes, the files should be made public while protecting the victims. Let me just ask you though, should all of the files related to Jeffrey Epstein be released and made public? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Yes. I agree with President Trump, with the Department of Justice, with the FBI that you need all credible evidence and information out there. That word credible is important. And why? Because you have to protect innocent people's names and reputations whose names might be, as you noted at the onset of the program, intertwined into all these has been a long legal process. There's a reason, for example, that grand jury materials are protected under the federal rules of criminal procedure because they're not to be put out. See, the Massie and Khanna discharge petition would require the would require the DOJ and FBI to release information that they know is false, that is based on lies and rumors and was not even credible enough to be entered into the court proceedings. And that would be a dangerous thing. Our main concern here, though, is the protection of the innocent victims. I mean, these are minors in many cases who were subjected to unspeakable crimes, abject evil. They've already suffered great harm. We do not need their names being unmasked. The Massie and the Khanna discharge petition does not have adequate protections. For example, in the way that it was drafted, they cite that they don't want child abuse, sex abuse information uncovered. But they cite the wrong provision of the federal code. And so it makes it unworkable. It requires the DOJ to release grand jury are prohibited by law from doing so. So it is not the right approach. There is another approach out there that House Republicans on the Rules Committee have a resolution that is well drafted, that is lawfully drafted by lawyers that would make this workable. That's the approach. We have to protect the innocent. We'll do it at all cost. KRISTEN WELKER: They do say that they want victims' names redacted though just to be clear. Let me move on to Ghislaine Maxwell — SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Yes, but their language doesn't adequately produce that. Yes. KRISTEN WELKER: Okay. SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Yes. KRISTEN WELKER: Let me move on to Ghislaine Maxwell. As you know, Mr. Speaker, the deputy attorney general spent two days interviewing her. She of course has been convicted of grooming, recruiting, abusing young teenage girls along with Jeffrey Epstein. Mr. Speaker, Maxwell's attorney said she answered all questions honestly and truthfully. But do you think that Ghislaine Maxwell can be trusted? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Well, I mean, look, it's a good question. I hope so. I hope that she would want to come clean. We certainly are interested in knowing everything that she knows. And as you'll know in our House Republican majority we're working towards that. Chairmen Comer and our Oversight Committee has already issued their own subpoena. They want to bring in Ghislaine Maxwell as well. I hope she's telling the truth. She is convicted. She is serving a 20-year sentence for child sex trafficking. And so her character is in some question. But if she wants to come clean now, that would be a great service to the country. And we'd like to know every single bit of information that she has. I certainly hope she's telling the truth. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, listen, this week President Trump didn't rule out a pardon for Ghislaine Maxwell. Of course, that's one of the big questions looming over all of this. So let me put this to you, Mr. Speaker, would you support a pardon or a commutation for Ghislaine Maxwell, a convicted sex trafficker? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Well, I mean, obviously that's a decision of the president. He said he had not adequately considered that. I won't get in front of him. That's not my lane. My lane is to help direct and control the House of Representatives and to use every tool within our arsenal to get to the truth. I'm going to say this as clearly and plainly and repeatedly as I can over and over. We are for maximum disclosure. We want all transparency. I trust the American people. I and the House Republicans believe that they should have all this information to be able to determine what they will. But we have to protect the innocent. And that's the only safeguard here that we've got to be diligent about. And I'm insistent upon doing so. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, I guess my question is: Are you open to a pardon or commutation? I mean, Mr. Speaker, the victims refer to Maxwell as Epstein's right-hand woman. Here's what one victim who testified under a pseudonym told the court at sentencing, quote, "The many acts that were perpetrated on me by Epstein including rape, strangulation and sexual assault were never consensual and would not have occurred had it not been for the cunning and premeditated role Ghislaine Maxwell played." Is that someone deserving of a pardon or commutation in any circumstance, Mr. Speaker? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: If you're asking my opinion, I think 20 years was a pittance. I think she should have a life sentence at least. I mean, think of all these unspeakable crimes. And as you noted earlier, probably 1,000 victims. I mean, you know, this is, it's hard to put into words how evil this was. And that she orchestrated it and was a big part of it, at least under the criminal sanction, I think is an unforgivable thing. So again, not my decision, but I have great pause about that as any reasonable person would. KRISTEN WELKER: Two more critical topics to get to with you, Mr. Speaker. Let's talk about what has been called the Big Beautiful Bill. In June, you told me the bill would not cut Medicaid. But two Republican senators ultimately voted against it because of what they thought were cuts to Medicaid. And Senator Josh Hawley is already out proposing legislation to actually roll back some of the Medicaid cuts that he just voted for. Did the Medicaid cuts go too far, Mr. Speaker? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: The bill does not cut Medicaid. The One Big Beautiful Bill does not cut Medicaid. What it does is strengthen the program. And we talked about this, Kristen, is that the problem is there's a high degree of fraud, waste and abuse in that program. I'm talking about 10s of billions of dollars every year. What we did is we went in to go in and fix that. We introduced work requirements which is a wildly popular notion in public opinion polling because it makes sense. Medicaid is a safety net program. It is intended for the elderly, the disabled, young, single pregnant women, young mothers. And those resources are being drained because you had able-bodied young men, for example, with no dependents who are riding the wagon. That's not right. It's morally wrong. And it doesn't comport with the law. So what we did in our Big Beautiful Bill is we went in to carve those guys out that program. They have work requirements now, 20 hours a week. They either have to be working, looking for a job, in a work training program or volunteering in their community, which is good for them and their surroundings. We find dignity in our work. We're proud of that reform. And by the way, there was a Harris and a Harvard poll that came out about two weeks ago. And they looked at 17 of the 21 primary provisions in that Big Beautiful Bill. And 17 out of 21 are majority supported in the public. And that's after the onslaught of the mainstream media and Democrats lying about the bill. So we're excited to go out into districts in August and tell the truth. KRISTEN WELKER: But Mr. Speaker, Josh Hawley says he is worried about cuts to payments and Medicaid reimbursements. Why would he be introducing a bill to roll back cuts to Medicaid if there were no cuts to Medicaid? He says the people in his state are going to suffer. SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: I haven't talked to my friend Josh Hawley about his legalization. I'm not sure what that's directed to. But I will tell you that the One Big Beautiful Bill safeguards the program. It strengthens it. It makes sure that Medicaid will be there for those who actually need it and who the law is intended to provide for. It is not for illegal aliens. We've kicked them off. It's not for people who are gaming the system. We've kicked them off. And it's not for people who should be working. They have to be able to prove that they're in one of these programs in order to get those benefits. And I think taxpayers will be served very well by that and everything else in the bill is wildly popular as well. KRISTEN WELKER: Let me ask you about a critical issue on the world world has been watching what has been unfolding Gaza. We are going to show some of these pictures. They're very disturbing. Mr. Speaker, of course, this humanitarian crisis, children starving to death. Israel has now paused military operations amid the international outcry over this hungry crisis. Are Israel's actions too little, too late, Mr. Speaker? SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: The images are disturbing and heartbreaking. We all want a peace there in that region. President Trump is trying to forge that. And we support it 100%. I will tell you that I have spoken to my friend Ambassador Leiter, the Israeli ambassador to the U.S., and to other Israeli officials. This is important to note. Israel, since this war began, has, has supplied over 94,000 truckloads full of food. It's enough food to feed two million people for two years, trying to get that into Gaza. But Hamas has stolen the food, a huge amount. In fact in 2024, the numbers are that Hamas profited over $500 million in stolen food aid that was supposed to go to these poor people who needed it. That's half of their budget. So this is a broken system. The UN needs to work with Israel to make sure that the food is getting to the people that need it most. The IDF I'm told, as recently as this morning, will begin tomorrow in opening new channels of distribution to get it to those people who are desperately in need. That's Israel's intention. That's the U.S.'s intention and the UN as well. KRISTEN WELKER: All right. Mr. Speaker, we are out of time. We should note the New York Times just yesterday did report that the IDF never found proof that Hamas had systematically, that word 'systematically" stolen deliveries of aid provided by the UN and other groups. We do really appreciate your joining us. And I hear you defending the Israeli position on that. Thank you Mr. Speaker. SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: You got it, thank you. Yes, thank you. KRISTEN WELKER: When we come back, Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina joins me next. KRISTEN WELKER: Welcome back. Joining me now is Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. Senator Graham, welcome back to Meet the Press. SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Thank you. KRISTEN WELKER: Thank you for being back. So, let's start with the Epstein files. Let me ask you the question I've asked everyone. You've just heard my conversations. Do you think that the Jeffrey Epstein files should be released in full, Senator? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Yeah. I liked what the speaker said. I am on board with Speaker Johnson to release as much as you can, protecting victims the best you can. KRISTEN WELKER: All right. Well, let me ask you about this twist that happened this week. President Trump seemed to want to try to shut down questions about the Epstein files by accusing former President Obama of treason. This came as his Director of National Intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, declassified documents which alleged top Obama officials manufactured information related to Russian interference in the 2016 election. Now, Senator, as you are well aware, this actually contradicts a bipartisan Senate Intelligence report led by Marco Rubio, which found that Russia did in fact interfere in the election. Do you actually believe that former President Obama committed treason? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Well, I think somebody needs to look at what we found. The intel committee looked at the matter. And they said in 2017, the intelligence analysis of 2017 showing that Russia was trying to interfere in our election was real. They didn't achieve their goal. But what she found, Ms. Gabbard, is that in 2016, the intelligence community told President Obama, "There's no evidence that Russia was involved in trying to change the outcome of the election." And he supposedly told a group of people, "Keep looking." And the analysis changed. So, what we're looking at is, what role did Obama play in 2016 to change the narrative that resulted in 2017? I'm not alleging he committed treason, but I am saying it bothers me, it's disturbing that this is new information. And now, you got the number two guy at the FBI, Dan-- Mr. Bongino, saying he's saying things that has changed his life. And I assume now he's referring to Russia. So, the best way to handle this is if there is evidence of a crime being committed or suspected evidence of a crime being committed, create a special counsel to look at it. I think that's the best way to go. KRISTEN WELKER: Okay. Let me follow up with you on your calls for a special counsel investigation. As you know, Senator, there was already a Trump-appointed special counsel at the time, investigating the origins of the Russia probe. It did not find any evidence of political interference. And, Senator, at the time, you agreed with the findings of the intelligence community. I want to play back what you said at the time. Take a look. SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Yep. [BEGIN TAPE] SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM The Russians did it. It was the Russians who tried to interfere in our election. Every member of the committee agrees it was the Russians. They didn't change the outcome, but they did release information embarrassing to the Democratic Party. It did affect Hillary Clinton. There's only one person in Washington that I know of that has any doubt about what Russia did in our election. And it's President Trump. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: Senator, are you now saying that you don't believe that Russia tried to interfere in the 2016 election? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Well, what I am saying is that you left a lot out here. It's called the Horowitz report. It's the Mueller investigation– was crooked and rotten to the core. The Washington Post and The New York Times got a Pulitzer prize for reporting on Trump's campaign's relationship with Russia. It was all BS. At the time, I didn't know any of that. At the time, I didn't know that they were manufacturing evidence to get FISA warrants. There was a confirmation bias. Durham didn't say there was no political bias. He said quite the opposite. He said every time a FISA warrant was sought in the Mueller world, they got it, and the errors made to get warrants in this space were a lot greater than they were in anything not involving Trump. But what I'm saying is that this is new evidence. This is something I didn't know, you didn't know, that in 2016 Obama suggested I don't like the outcome that there's no evidence Russia was involved. Well, now we all say Russia was involved. But in 2016, they said Russia wasn't involved. What the hell happened? KRISTEN WELKER: Senator– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Let's get a special counsel. KRISTEN WELKER: Hold on, Senator. As you know, former President Obama has weighed in through a spokesperson. He says that's just patently false. SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Yes. KRISTEN WELKER: I actually spoke to Susan Miller, who's a former senior CIA officer who helped to oversee the 2017 intelligence assessment on Russian interference. She says it's completely false that Obama or anyone else asked them to change or sway their investigation. SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: What else did he say? KRISTEN WELKER: She says they all– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: What else did he say? KRISTEN WELKER: She says, and she's a Republican, they all would have quit if that had happened, Senator. Are you trying to– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: No. No. KRISTEN WELKER: –rewrite history to distract from the Epstein matter, Senator? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: No. I am trying to let you know and the media know that we found something we didn't know before. At the end of the day, I'm not calling for prosecution against President Obama for treason. But, I am calling for an investigation. Mr. Mueller also said there was no credible evidence that President Trump colluded with the Russians. For years, and months, and days, and weeks, people had their lives turned upside down, chasing the Mueller narrative that Trump was in bed with the Russians, that the Trump campaign was colluding with the Russians. The only people colluding with the Russians were the Hillary Clinton campaign and Christopher Steele manufacturing a document to get warrants against Carter Page, based on lies and falsehoods. So, yeah, I'm very familiar with it. What you don't seem to acknowledge is there's something new being found. Rather than reinventing the wheel here, let's go back to a special counsel model to look at this something new. KRISTEN WELKER: But, Senator– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: The something new is statements by President Obama, "I don't like your analysis. Russia wasn't involved here," in 2016. KRISTEN WELKER: Senator, you're saying there's something new. This report goes back to 2020. It's five years old. There's actually nothing new in this report and nothing that changes anything-- SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: The evidence that she turned over– KRISTEN WELKER: I want to talk about Gaza, Senator. SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: –is new to me. KRISTEN WELKER: Senator– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: It's new to me. KRISTEN WELKER: But, Senator– SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: You're trying to sweep this stuff under the rug. And that's not right. Let's go to Gaza. KRISTEN WELKER: But, Senator, you know that at the time, you said you did believe the assessments and the multiple investigations. But let me move onto Gaza. Let's talk about Gaza, Senator, because this is so important. As I just talked about with the House speaker, the world is just watching this humanitarian crisis unfold. President Trump said he told Prime Minister Netanyahu to quote, "Finish the job, this week." I know that you are in touch with President Trump. You're in touch with Israeli officials. What are you anticipating is going to happen next? What does, "Finish the job," mean, Senator? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: Well, I talked to Cindy McCain last night. Here's some good news for the people in Gaza. Humanitarian corridors are now going to be open. Israel is going to work with the UN, the World Food Program, to get some food into these people, who need it. But, I think what the topic we're talking about today is a change in strategy. I think President Trump has come to believe, and I've certainly come to believe, there's no way you're going to negotiate an end of this war with Hamas. Hamas is a terrorist organization who is chartered to destroy the state of Israel. They're religious Nazis. They hold Israeli hostages. I think Israel's come to conclude that they can't achieve a goal of ending the war with Hamas that would be satisfactory to the safety of Israel and that they're going to do in Gaza what we did in Tokyo and Berlin; take the place by force then start over again, presenting a better future for the Palestinians, hopefully having the Arabs take over the West Bank and Gaza. But I think going forward, Kristen, you're going to see a change in tactics, a full military effort by Israel to take Gaza down, like we did in Tokyo and Berlin. KRISTEN WELKER: Senator, bottom line, does that mean the hostages are not going to be coming back alive, if Israel were to move forward with what you're effectively saying? SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM: I hope not. I think there are people, maybe, in the Hamas organization that would accept safe passage if they released the hostages. If I were Israel, I would make that offer to Hamas fighters, "You can leave safely. We want our hostages back." But here's the problem Israel has. They're losing soldiers, four and five a week. I hope and pray the hostages will come back. Hamas could end this tomorrow, laying down their weapons and releasing the hostages. There is no future for the Palestinian people, as long as Hamas is around. So all I can say is that you're going to see, I think, in the next days and weeks, a military effort to destroy Hamas, akin to what we did in Tokyo and Berlin to destroy the Nazis and the Japanese. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, we all are praying for those hostages, still. Senator Lindsey Graham, thank you so much. When we come back, the cancellation of a late-night comedy show and what we've heard from its iconic host over the years. Our Meet the Press Minute is next. KRISTEN WELKER: Welcome back. It's the end of an era for a late night institution. CBS announced last week that The Late Show with Stephen Colbert will end its run in May of next year. The decision comes after the parent company of CBS settled a lawsuit with President Trump. Before Stephen Colbert took the helm of The Late Show in 2015 he rose to fame on Comedy Central, where he hosted the satirical Colbert Report playing a character named Stephen Colbert, a right-wing anchorman. In 2007, Colbert joined Meet the Press, where he talked about the importance of making his audience, and himself, laugh. [BEGIN TAPE] TIM RUSSERT: I read a wonderful quote from you. You were talking about humor, and particularly after September 11th, 2001. And you said, "You can't laugh and be afraid at the same time." STEPHEN COLBERT: That's not a philosophical statement. I think it's a physiological statement. When you laugh you're not afraid. And sometimes you laugh because you're afraid. But when you laugh, the laughter goes away. And it's not just whistling past the graveyard. It actually just goes away when you're laughing. And that's why I don't think I could ever stop doing what I'm doing, because I laugh all day long. And if I didn't, I would just cry all day long. [END TAPE] KRISTEN WELKER: When we come back, President Trump facing pressure from his own base over the Epstein files. The panel is next. KRISTEN WELKER: Welcome back. The panel is here. Amna Nawaz, co-anchor of PBS NewsHour; Peter Baker, chief White House correspondent for The New York Times; former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson; and former Republican Congressman Carlos Curbelo. Peter, let me start with you. You've been writing extensively about the Epstein matter. It's broken through in a way that other scandals haven't. President Trump can't shake it. Why? What's different? PETER BAKER: Well, look, this is a president who came to the political stage stoking conspiracy theories, stoking suspicion of government, suspicion of elites, and now suddenly he's in charge of the government that won't release the files that people say show that he was right. And so it's, of course, coming back to bite him with the very people he has cultivated over the last decade basically. KRISTEN WELKER: Well, and Amna, it's so fascinating because all of the guests this morning said they want the Epstein files released in some form or fashion. What did you make of what we heard this morning? AMNA NAWAZ: There's been a little bit of an evolution to the Republican messaging. You see the qualifying statements there about, "Just the credible information. We want to make sure we're protecting victims." All of that is absolutely true. No one's arguing otherwise. But you know, President Trump and his supporters are asking his base to really get their heads around a lot. It's a lot of whiplash. You had in January people closest to him, like Kash Patel at his confirmation hearing, saying, "We're going to get all the information out." You had in February Attorney General Pam Bondi saying, "I have the client list on my desk." By July, they're saying there's nothing there, there's no client list. "Pay no attention to this." I should say the president's been somewhat consistent on this. Even last June, during the presidential campaign, he was saying he supports some release of the information, but he wants to protect victims. He doesn't want the phony stuff coming out, as he says. But the context for this is that this is a guy who now faces Americans, more than half of whom say they don't like the way he's handled this issue. 37% approval rating, that's a ten-point drop from the beginning of the term. It's a lot for the president. Carlos, it is having an impact. How significant is this divide in the MAGA base? Is it real? Is it lasting, do you think? CARLOS CURBELO: It is very significant because it is so contradictory to what the base believes about Donald Trump. Donald Trump is the anti-establishment superhero. He is the populist superhero for his base. And now for the first time he's the one saying, "Let's be measured. Let's keep this information hidden." So that's very shocking. And House Republicans in particular, the ones in swing districts – it's ironic because the ones that are sweating right now are the hardliners. Members in swing districts really aren't having to talk about this very much. But the ones in swing districts depend on that base. And if there's any lack of enthusiasm in that base going into 2026, then that could have real consequences. KRISTEN WELKER: Jeh, talk about what we heard from Senator Lindsey Graham, this effort to try to bring former President Obama, the attention back on the investigation into Russian meddling in the 2016 election. You heard what Senator Graham had to say. What do you make of that part of the story? JEH JOHNSON: I'll just repeat what my former boss, President Obama, said: "It's bizarre." Doesn't make any sense. To the extent people want to re-litigate what happened nine years ago, first it's important to go back to October 2016. We had an evolving intelligence picture, but we believed it was important that the American people know that there was a foreign actor with his thumb on the scale. What we did not say pre-election, we believed they were trying to help Trump hurt Clinton. After the election, the president wanted to put out as much as possible to the American people so the public would understand what happened. There was the assessment done in January 2017 that said that the Russian government favored Trump, was out to hurt Clinton. Most significantly were the congressional reviews, specifically the Senate intel committee. Their final version of the report on this came out in November 2020 during a lame duck session, after Trump had lost but while the Republicans were still in control of the Senate. A lame duck – forgive me, Carlos – is when, you know, Congress tells you what they really think about things. And so the SSCI report, done by a very professional, Republican-driven staff, made the same conclusion that the -- the Russians were out to help Trump, hurt Clinton in even more forceful terms. KRISTEN WELKER: And that is the idea, that there were just so many investigations -- JEH JOHNSON: Chaired, by the way, by now -- KRISTEN WELKER: FORMER SECRETARY JEH JOHNSON: – Secretary of State, Marco Rubio. KRISTEN WELKER: Yes, indeed. Peter Baker, zoom out for us. How might this impact Republicans, Democrats in the midterms? PETER BAKER: Well, it's a way of trying to muddy the waters, right? You know, "Don't pay attention to this; pay attention to that." What you saw is the President of the United States put out an artificial intelligence video showing Obama being handcuffed in the Oval Office and put in prison. And another image over the weekend showing him in the white Bronco, as if he was O.J. Simpson budget chased by police officers. We should stop for a second and remind ourselves that this is not what presidents do. Presidents don't do that. Even if you think there were some criminal issue, no president is supposed to weigh in on an issue that might be adjudicated like that. He has taken a fog of innuendo, a smattering of selective facts, and added that up to say, "This is a years-long coup." That was the phrase Tulsi Gabbard used, and treason. And there's zero backing that up, but it's a way of trying to get the base energized against a common enemy, that enemy, of course, being Barack Obama and Democrats. KRISTEN WELKER: And Democrats are trying to energize the base with the Epstein matter. The question is will it overshadow – what I put to Ro Khanna, will it overshadow the pocketbook issue? AMNA NAWAZ: Look, I don't think we know what's going to happen next week, let alone in the midterms just yet, how much this actually resonates with voters. We do not know. But I will say, I know we're having this conversation in a political context related to Epstein because it's an issue right now with Democrats and Republicans, to not lose sight of the victims in all of this is important. And I just want to give a quick shoutout to people like Julie Brown of The Miami Herald, the journalist who uncovered a lot of these heinous crimes in the first place. You and your team here, Peter and his team, my team at The NewsHour, even in federal funding cuts are working on this. If there's going to be credible information that comes out from this, it's going to be because it's led by the facts, not by politics. CARLOS CURBELO: And look, the best thing for Republicans to do is to get some information out there as soon as possible, maybe get Pam Bondi answering some real questions. Best thing for Democrats to do is to stay out of the way. If they make this an us versus them issue, that's the best that happen to Donald Trump. JEH JOHNSON: I agree. I worry that a large segment of the American public is drowning in conspiracy theories. I think Democrats should stay away from this, focus on what we know really matters to the American people: pocketbook issues, the economy, tariffs, so forth. KRISTEN WELKER: All right. Powerful final message. Thank you all for joining us. Really appreciate it. That is all for today. Thank you for watching. We'll be back next week, because if it's Sunday, it's Meet the Press.
The Hill
36 minutes ago
- The Hill
Massie says Epstein controversy ‘going to hurt Republicans in the midterms'
Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.) on Sunday said that the current controversy over convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein is 'going to hurt Republicans in the midterms.' 'This is going to hurt Republicans in the midterms, the voters will be apathetic if we don't hold the rich and powerful accountable,' Massie told NBC News's Kristen Welker on 'Meet the Press' in an interview alongside Rep. Ro Khanna (D-Calif.) 'I think when we get back, we can get the signatures required to force this to the floor. Speaker Mike Johnson should do the right thing and just bring it to the floor and not require us to force it. And he'll have a choice once we get those 218 signatures,' he added, talking about the House's current recess and his resolution with Khanna on files related to Epstein. President Trump and his administration have recently been facing pressure from both sides of the aisle over Epstein's case, with the saga throwing Congress into chaos. The House broke on Wednesday for its weeks-long August recess, shutting down one day earlier than initially planned, as the chamber was stuck in a logjam over the Epstein controversy. Massie and Khanna's bill is one of two measures linked to the Epstein files, with 34 co-sponsors, 11 of them Republican. Some of the GOP names backing the bill include Reps. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.), Tim Burchett (R-Tenn.) and Lauren Boebert (R-Colo.). House Speaker Mike Johnson (R-La.) said in an interview that aired Thursday that files related to Epstein are 'not a hoax.' 'It's not a hoax, of course not,' Johnson said in an interview with CBS News's Major Garrett on 'The Takeout.' 'I mean, there are real victims here, but that's part of a delicate — the balance that's being done here is, I tried to explain in my press conference this week, man, we want full disclosure. If I had … these things in my possession, I would have put them out a long time ago, but I would also have been very careful to protect the innocent,' the Speaker added. The Hill has reached out to Johnson's office for comment.
Indianapolis Star
an hour ago
- Indianapolis Star
Republicans trapped between Trump's Epstein secrecy and angry constituents
What are you doing during your summer vacation? U.S. House Speaker Mike Johnson apparently plans to spend his six-week break trying to get his story straight about the Epstein files fiasco. That's a daunting challenge for the Republican from Louisiana, who has flip-flopped from calling for "transparency" on the issue to sending the House home early on July 22 to shut down Republican attempts to release those files. But that's life when you unconditionally surrender the Article I powers that the U.S. Constitution grants Congress as a coequal branch of government to a scandal-prone presidency held by Donald Trump. If Johnson's vacation were a scary summer movie, we'd have to call it 'I Know What You Did With the Epstein Files.' Things don't look much better for the Republicans who are in control of the U.S. Senate. Trump wants that chamber to work through the summer break so it can rubber-stamp his nominees for various positions. If this also were a horror film, it would be a sequel – "No Way Out, Again" – because Trump did the same thing with a compliant Senate during his first term in 2018. So here are the options for congressional Republicans from now until early September: Go home and endure town halls with constituents angry about Trump's broken promise to release the Epstein files and the looming negative impacts of his signature budget bill. Or stay in Washington and answer a growing rush of questions as the Epstein news keeps beating like a "Tell-Tale Heart." Scary stuff, indeed. Johnson has served less as a speaker of the House and more like a servant to Trump's expectations. And that was working for him. He helped pass Trump's budget bill, which slashes health care for the working poor while offering short-term tax relief for some in return for permanent tax cuts for America's wealthiest people. He did that as well with Trump's "rescission" package, which canceled federal funding that Johnson's own House had previously approved. He and Trump were looking forward to a victory lap on all that, despite consistent polling that shows a majority of American voters don't care for it at all. Opinion: Indiana's economy has grown fangs — and it's feeding on taxpayers But the scandal surrounding Jeffrey Epstein, who has been dead for six years, will not pass away. Trump exploited conspiracy theories on the reelection campaign trail about his old cruising buddy, a convicted pedophile who died in prison in 2019 during Trump's first term while awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges. But then Trump, who promised while campaigning in 2024 to release the Department of Justice's files on Epstein, decided recently to keep them secret, enraging his own supporters and putting his Republican allies in Congress in a tight spot. Maybe it's just a coincidence that Attorney General Pam Bondi is reported to have briefed Trump in May that he is mentioned in those very files that his supporters want to see released. So Trump's in a tight spot, too. Johnson's slipshod response to the Epstein secrecy has been to advocate for transparency, which Trump doesn't want, and then revert to presidential servitude by trying to stamp out any attempts at transparency. This has provoked something we rarely see anymore – bipartisanship – as Republican and Democratic members of the House voted together to subpoena the Epstein files. This doesn't look like it will simmer down in six weeks. Republicans are hitting the road with a story that isn't selling well. A July 23 Fox News poll found that 67% of American voters think Trump's administration has not been transparent about Epstein, including 60% of the Republicans surveyed and 56% of Trump's so-called MAGA supporters. And then there's this: Fox News found that 4 out of 5 people in the survey said they were following the Epstein case. We're closing in on the end of July – vacation season – and these people are tuned all the way in on this. Opinion: Tariffs will cost families $2,500 this year — but wages won't rise to help Trump's budget bill was also underwater in the poll, with 58% disapproving and 39% in support. That makes for testy town halls, if the Republicans dare to hold them in the next six weeks. And that feels like a lose-lose scenario with the 2026 midterm elections looming ever larger. Face your angry constituents and be ready to go viral on social media, exactly the kind of things that would-be opponents mine for campaign commercials. Or duck and cover and get branded a coward, exactly the kind of thing that would-be opponents exploit for campaign commercials. No matter which way Republicans go, at home or in Washington, they should first ask themselves: Does Trump care about how any of this impacts me and my future in politics, or is he only interested in protecting himself? I think they already know the answer. Trump is – now, in the past, in the future, always – looking out only for himself. That prompts two more questions. Why is he working so hard to keep the Epstein files secret? And do you really want to be on the record helping him with that secrecy if the files are finally released?
